[sip-comm-dev] behaviors of cliks and double clicks on the tray icon


#1

Hi all,

Even though I am using the sc tray icon for a while now, I admit I still dont master it.
Sometimes, the main app window, dont popups when I want to show it or it appears then hides immediatly because of many clicks.

Here is the behavior I observed from some popular IM clients (on windows at least).

1) when the main window is not visible

  a) single click

- yahoo does nothing, idem for SC
- msn handles it as a right button click (it shows a popupmenu)

  b) double click

- both yahoo, msn implement the same behavior, the window comes to front, idem for SC.

2) when the main window is visible

  a) single click

- yahoo does nothing, idem for SC.
- msn handles it as a right button click (it shows a popupmenu)

  b) double click

- both yahoo and msn do nothing. SC hides the main window

We can see the main difference is 2.b.

Something I notice is : when I usually go after the tray icon of an app, it is to show the app window or to use its popup menu. Not to hide the app window, I rather use the close button in that case.
But, I dont know if most of users acts like that. If it is the case, WDYT on implementing the msn or yahoo behavior (personally I will go for yahoo) ?

I also propose to add a "show sip communicator" menu item in the popup menu, which brings the app window to front, as most apps do (IM or not).

Regards

Sympho

···

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#2

Even though I am using the sc tray icon for a while now, I admit I still dont master it.

I feel the same way about my experience. I embarrass myself just about
every time I try to use the SC tray icon. (Admittedly, Windows 7
explodes the problem because these tray icons are not visible and one
has to explicitly configure it to show up or click once more every
time.)

I also propose to add a "show sip communicator" menu item in the popup menu, which brings the app window to front, as most apps do (IM or not).

I support the idea because I'm used to it in other apps and I catch
myself looking for it in the SC tray icon from time to time (when I
remember to not click multiple times and still not get the SC window
displayed).

As a whole I don't have a favorite between single and double click,
but I think any one of them will be sufficient for me as long as
performing the click doesn't hide the window when it's already shown
(which I think is in-line with Sympho's preference for Yahoo).

···

On Wed, Feb 18, 2009 at 3:08 PM, sympho <sympho@ebcservice.com> wrote:

Hi all,

Even though I am using the sc tray icon for a while now, I admit I still dont master it.
Sometimes, the main app window, dont popups when I want to show it or it appears then hides immediatly because of many clicks.

Here is the behavior I observed from some popular IM clients (on windows at least).

1) when the main window is not visible

a) single click

- yahoo does nothing, idem for SC
- msn handles it as a right button click (it shows a popupmenu)

b) double click

- both yahoo, msn implement the same behavior, the window comes to front, idem for SC.

2) when the main window is visible

a) single click

- yahoo does nothing, idem for SC.
- msn handles it as a right button click (it shows a popupmenu)

b) double click

- both yahoo and msn do nothing. SC hides the main window

We can see the main difference is 2.b.

Something I notice is : when I usually go after the tray icon of an app, it is to show the app window or to use its popup menu. Not to hide the app window, I rather use the close button in that case.
But, I dont know if most of users acts like that. If it is the case, WDYT on implementing the msn or yahoo behavior (personally I will go for yahoo) ?

I also propose to add a "show sip communicator" menu item in the popup menu, which brings the app window to front, as most apps do (IM or not).

Regards

Sympho

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#3

Hi Sympho,

Even though I am using the sc tray icon for a while now, I admit I
still dont master it. Sometimes, the main app window, dont popups
when I want to show it or it appears then hides immediatly because of
many clicks.

The same applies for me, but not for the same reason.

Here is the behavior I observed from some popular IM clients (on windows at least).

FYI here is the common behaviour under Gnome (and also KDE I believe):

- if the window is hidden, a single-click on the notification icon
   shows it and brings it to front on the active workspace

- if the window is shown and has the focus on the active workspace, a
   single-click on the notification icon hides it

- if the window is shown and doesn't have the focus or isn't on the
   active workspace, a single-click on the notification icon shows it
   brings it to front on the active workspace

This is the observed behaviour with Pidgin and Gajim. Psi is less smart
and hides the window if it is shown (even if it doesn't have the focus).

I known no notification area icon (even for non IM applications) which
requires double-click for an action on Gnome. That's why I find SC
current notification area icon awkward to use.

Something I notice is : when I usually go after the tray icon of an
app, it is to show the app window or to use its popup menu. Not to
hide the app window, I rather use the close button in that case. But,
I dont know if most of users acts like that. If it is the case, WDYT
on implementing the msn or yahoo behavior (personally I will go for
yahoo) ?

I think hiding Gajim/Pidgin makes sense but I understand the windowish
habit of double-clicking at any occasion (some users even double-click
hyperlinks, and this makes sense from their point of view which is
double-click=action, single-click=selection). I'd rather use the
single-click.
IIRC it is possible to distinguish a double-click from 2 single-clicks
with Java/Swing. Then we could please most of the users by processing
single-clicks and double-clicks as the same action.

WDYT?

I also propose to add a "show sip communicator" menu item in the popup
menu, which brings the app window to front, as most apps do (IM or
not).

This feature is also present on Psi, Gajim and Pidgin (labelled "show
contact list" most of the time, on Pidgin this is a check box so that
you can also hide the contact list this way).

Cheers,

···

On Wed, Feb 18, 2009 at 01:08:10PM +0000, sympho wrote:

--
Sébastien Mazy

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#4

Hi,

One more thing :

I see the visible status is stored via the configuration service and when SC starts, it is hidden if it was when we exited.

I feel it a bit confusing not see an app when I launch it. Wouldnt it better to always starts SC with the main window in front ?

--- En date de : Mer 18.2.09, Lubomir Marinov <lubomir.marinov@gmail.com> a écrit :

···

De: Lubomir Marinov <lubomir.marinov@gmail.com>
Objet: Re: [sip-comm-dev] behaviors of cliks and double clicks on the tray icon
À: dev@sip-communicator.dev.java.net
Date: Mercredi 18 Février 2009, 14h18
> Even though I am using the sc tray icon for a while
now, I admit I still dont master it.

I feel the same way about my experience. I embarrass myself
just about
every time I try to use the SC tray icon. (Admittedly,
Windows 7
explodes the problem because these tray icons are not
visible and one
has to explicitly configure it to show up or click once
more every
time.)

> I also propose to add a "show sip
communicator" menu item in the popup menu, which brings
the app window to front, as most apps do (IM or not).

I support the idea because I'm used to it in other apps
and I catch
myself looking for it in the SC tray icon from time to time
(when I
remember to not click multiple times and still not get the
SC window
displayed).

As a whole I don't have a favorite between single and
double click,
but I think any one of them will be sufficient for me as
long as
performing the click doesn't hide the window when
it's already shown
(which I think is in-line with Sympho's preference for
Yahoo).

On Wed, Feb 18, 2009 at 3:08 PM, sympho > <sympho@ebcservice.com> wrote:
> Hi all,
>
> Even though I am using the sc tray icon for a while
now, I admit I still dont master it.
> Sometimes, the main app window, dont popups when I
want to show it or it appears then hides immediatly because
of many clicks.
>
> Here is the behavior I observed from some popular IM
clients (on windows at least).
>
> 1) when the main window is not visible
>
> a) single click
>
> - yahoo does nothing, idem for SC
> - msn handles it as a right button click (it shows a
popupmenu)
>
> b) double click
>
> - both yahoo, msn implement the same behavior, the
window comes to front, idem for SC.
>
> 2) when the main window is visible
>
> a) single click
>
> - yahoo does nothing, idem for SC.
> - msn handles it as a right button click (it shows a
popupmenu)
>
> b) double click
>
> - both yahoo and msn do nothing. SC hides the main
window
>
> We can see the main difference is 2.b.
>
> Something I notice is : when I usually go after the
tray icon of an app, it is to show the app window or to use
its popup menu. Not to hide the app window, I rather use the
close button in that case.
> But, I dont know if most of users acts like that. If
it is the case, WDYT on implementing the msn or yahoo
behavior (personally I will go for yahoo) ?
>
> I also propose to add a "show sip
communicator" menu item in the popup menu, which brings
the app window to front, as most apps do (IM or not).
>
> Regards
>
> Sympho
>
>
> ______________________
> http://ebcservice.com
>
>
>
>
>
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> To unsubscribe, e-mail:
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> For additional commands, e-mail:
dev-help@sip-communicator.dev.java.net
>
>

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#5

Hi,

- if the window is hidden, a single-click on the
notification icon
   shows it and brings it to front on the active workspace

- if the window is shown and has the focus on the active
workspace, a
   single-click on the notification icon hides it

If the user clicks twice is the window shown then hidden, or it deppends on the clicks speed ?

- if the window is shown and doesn't have the focus or
isn't on the
   active workspace, a single-click on the notification
icon shows it
   brings it to front on the active workspace

Didnt mentioned it before, but yahoo and msn also act like that.

This is the observed behaviour with Pidgin and Gajim. Psi
is less smart
and hides the window if it is shown (even if it doesn't
have the focus).

I known no notification area icon (even for non IM
applications) which
requires double-click for an action on Gnome. That's
why I find SC
current notification area icon awkward to use.

> Something I notice is : when I usually go after the
tray icon of an
> app, it is to show the app window or to use its popup
menu. Not to
> hide the app window, I rather use the close button in
that case. But,
> I dont know if most of users acts like that. If it is
the case, WDYT
> on implementing the msn or yahoo behavior (personally
I will go for
> yahoo) ?

I think hiding Gajim/Pidgin makes sense but I understand
the windowish
habit of double-clicking at any occasion (some users even
double-click
hyperlinks, and this makes sense from their point of view
which is
double-click=action, single-click=selection). I'd
rather use the
single-click.
IIRC it is possible to distinguish a double-click from 2
single-clicks
with Java/Swing. Then we could please most of the users by
processing
single-clicks and double-clicks as the same action.

WDYT?

In fact, the systray service receives an ActionEvent when the user double click on the tray icon and nothing on a single click (on windows). Because of that, we could get the standard gnome behavior only if the ActionEvent is delivered on single click on linux.

> I also propose to add a "show sip
communicator" menu item in the popup
> menu, which brings the app window to front, as most
apps do (IM or
> not).

This feature is also present on Psi, Gajim and Pidgin
(labelled "show
contact list" most of the time, on Pidgin this is a
check box so that
you can also hide the contact list this way).

I think Psi an Gaim behavior is ok, since it is also what windows users (and I guess others OS users) are used to. Havent seen how the Pidgin check box looks like.

Sympho

···

Cheers,

--
Sébastien Mazy

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#6

If the user clicks twice is the window shown then hidden, or it deppends on the clicks speed ?

On Psi, it depends on the click speed. A real double-click does the same
thing as a single-click.

On Gajim and Pidgin, a double-click is processed as two single-clicks
(briefly shows or hides).

> IIRC it is possible to distinguish a double-click from 2
> single-clicks with Java/Swing. Then we could please most of the
> users by processing single-clicks and double-clicks as the same
> action.

In fact, the systray service receives an ActionEvent when the user
double click on the tray icon and nothing on a single click (on
windows). Because of that, we could get the standard gnome behavior
only if the ActionEvent is delivered on single click on linux.

Too bad.

> This feature is also present on Psi, Gajim and Pidgin (labelled
> "show contact list" most of the time, on Pidgin this is a check box
> so that you can also hide the contact list this way).

I think Psi an Gaim behavior is ok, since it is also what windows
users (and I guess others OS users) are used to. Havent seen how the
Pidgin check box looks like.

See attached screenshot.

···

On Wed, Feb 18, 2009 at 04:47:07PM +0000, sympho wrote:

--
Sébastien Mazy


#7

I have a use case which requires it. If you start and stop SC
automatically respectively on login and logoff, you don't want to see
your contact list pop up at every login, unless it was shown when you
last logged off.

BTW, you don't want to see SC's splashscreen either in the "start
hidden" case.

···

On Wed, Feb 18, 2009 at 03:24:10PM +0000, sympho wrote:

I see the visible status is stored via the configuration service and
when SC starts, it is hidden if it was when we exited.

--
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#8

The Windows version also has the option to start on system startup and
I guess the contact list doesn't have to pop up if the application was
last left with a closed contact list. If I was to decide, I'd say the
splashscreen shouldn't be shown then as well.

···

On Thu, Feb 19, 2009 at 12:41 PM, Sébastien Mazy <smazy@dev.java.net> wrote:

On Wed, Feb 18, 2009 at 03:24:10PM +0000, sympho wrote:

I see the visible status is stored via the configuration service and
when SC starts, it is hidden if it was when we exited.

I have a use case which requires it. If you start and stop SC
automatically respectively on login and logoff, you don't want to see
your contact list pop up at every login, unless it was shown when you
last logged off.

BTW, you don't want to see SC's splashscreen either in the "start
hidden" case.

--
Sébastien Mazy

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#9

Hi,

I agree that SC dont have to popup if auto started and was hidden last time (the splash screen should also be hidden in that case).
But in case the user "manually" start it, will he always have the reflex to look in the systray ? We have to consider that th tray icon could be hidden by the OS for one raison or anoother.
Is it possible to discriminate an auto start from a manual start by adding some parameter on the auto start link ? Otherwise we could give some notification in the systray when SC start.

WDYT ?

Sympho

--- En date de : Jeu 19.2.09, Lubomir Marinov <lubomir.marinov@gmail.com> a écrit :

···

De: Lubomir Marinov <lubomir.marinov@gmail.com>
Objet: Re: [sip-comm-dev] behaviors of cliks and double clicks on the tray icon
À: dev@sip-communicator.dev.java.net
Date: Jeudi 19 Février 2009, 11h45
The Windows version also has the option to start on system
startup and
I guess the contact list doesn't have to pop up if the
application was
last left with a closed contact list. If I was to decide,
I'd say the
splashscreen shouldn't be shown then as well.

On Thu, Feb 19, 2009 at 12:41 PM, Sébastien Mazy > <smazy@dev.java.net> wrote:
> On Wed, Feb 18, 2009 at 03:24:10PM +0000, sympho > wrote:
>> I see the visible status is stored via the
configuration service and
>> when SC starts, it is hidden if it was when we
exited.
>
> I have a use case which requires it. If you start and
stop SC
> automatically respectively on login and logoff, you
don't want to see
> your contact list pop up at every login, unless it was
shown when you
> last logged off.
>
> BTW, you don't want to see SC's splashscreen
either in the "start
> hidden" case.
>
> --
> Sébastien Mazy
>
>
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