[jitsi-users] XMPP vs SIP vs icq vs ippi vs iptel ...


#1

There are 10 different "networks" in "add new account." What is confusing to
someone like me is what is interoperable with what?

I have an XMPP account.

Can I "add contact" of someone who has a SIP account and be able to a. text
chat b. voice chat and c. video chat with them?

What about with someone who has an

AIM, Facebook, Google talk, ICQ, ippi, iptel.org, MSN (SIP, XMPP mentioned
already)or Yahoo! Account?

I can get people to install jitsi but it would be easier if I have them log
in with the accounts they already have from other sources - some won't want
to register another username and password.

Can someone give me a grouping of the above 10 network types such that each
subgroup can communicate with all in their own subgroup?


#2

Hello,

There are 10 different �networks� in �add new account.� What is
confusing to someone like me is what is interoperable with what?

I have an XMPP account.

Can I �add contact� of someone who has a SIP account and be able to a.
text chat b. voice chat and c. video chat with them?

No, you can't do that.

What about with someone who has an

AIM, Facebook, Google talk, ICQ, ippi, iptel.org, MSN (SIP, XMPP
mentioned already)or Yahoo! Account?

The only one that will work is Google Talk. And the current situation with audio/video calls is...uncertain.

I can get people to install jitsi but it would be easier if I have them
log in with the accounts they already have from other sources � some
won�t want to register another username and password.

Can someone give me a grouping of the above 10 network types such that
each subgroup can communicate with all in their own subgroup?

Strictly this isn't possible, because XMPP and SIP are protocols rather than services. You can never guarantee that a SIP account will be able to communicate with any other SIP account, for example.

AIM, Facebook, ICQ, MSN and Yahoo! can only talk to each other.

ippi and iptel.org use SIP and seem to work with other SIP services.

Regards,
Boris

···

On 7/12/13 7:40 AM, Joe wrote:


#3

You can never guarantee that a SIP account will be able to communicate

with any other SIP account, for example.

!!!!!!

How can this be?? Isn't SIP the email of VoIP?


#4

Let me summarize and tell me if I got something wrong.

The following 3/10 'networks on the list are SIP servers: 1. ippi 2.
iptel.org 3. SIP

The following 7/10 networks on the list are XMPP servers: 1. AIM, 2.
Facebook, 3. Google talk, 4. ICQ, 5. MSN 6. Yahoo! 7. XMPP

There are only two general protocols, SIP and XMPP, that all audio/video
peer-to-peer communication operates under.

All SIP providers should fundamentally allow cross communication but may not
(not guaranteed to) since individual providers may put their own
restrictions on it but all SIP servers in the list seem to allow
cross-communication.

Is XMPP similar to SIP in that - All XMPP providers should fundamentally
allow cross communication but may not (not guaranteed to) since individual
providers may put their own restrictions on it
   - BUT it happens to be that in the list the providers seem to NOT allow
cross communication?

Thanks for the helpful replies.

···

-----Original Message-----
From: Boris Grozev [mailto:boris@jitsi.org]
Sent: Friday, July 12, 2013 2:48 AM
To: Jitsi Users
Cc: Joe
Subject: Re: [jitsi-users] XMPP vs SIP vs icq vs ippi vs iptel ...

Hello,

On 7/12/13 7:40 AM, Joe wrote:

There are 10 different "networks" in "add new account." What is
confusing to someone like me is what is interoperable with what?

I have an XMPP account.

Can I "add contact" of someone who has a SIP account and be able to a.
text chat b. voice chat and c. video chat with them?

No, you can't do that.

What about with someone who has an

AIM, Facebook, Google talk, ICQ, ippi, iptel.org, MSN (SIP, XMPP
mentioned already)or Yahoo! Account?

The only one that will work is Google Talk. And the current situation with
audio/video calls is...uncertain.

I can get people to install jitsi but it would be easier if I have
them log in with the accounts they already have from other sources -
some won't want to register another username and password.

Can someone give me a grouping of the above 10 network types such that
each subgroup can communicate with all in their own subgroup?

Strictly this isn't possible, because XMPP and SIP are protocols rather than
services. You can never guarantee that a SIP account will be able to
communicate with any other SIP account, for example.

AIM, Facebook, ICQ, MSN and Yahoo! can only talk to each other.

ippi and iptel.org use SIP and seem to work with other SIP services.

Regards,
Boris


#5

One quick comment here:

···

On 12.07.13, 08:48, Boris Grozev wrote:

The only one that will work is Google Talk. And the current situation
with audio/video calls is...uncertain.

Audio/Video calling a Jitsi user connected to Gmail should generally work.

Audio/Video calling a Gmail user connected from their web interface is guaranteed NOT to work.

Emil

--
https://jitsi.org


#6

Ha, that would be a great fantasy...

SIP is more like the English of the world. You might speak it but with
your accent I might still have a hard time understanding you.

···

On Fri, Jul 12, 2013 at 5:03 AM, Ansis Māliņš <ansis.malins@gmail.com>wrote:

>You can never guarantee that a SIP account will be able to communicate
with any other SIP account, for example.

!!!!!!

How can this be?? Isn't SIP the email of VoIP?

_______________________________________________
users mailing list
users@jitsi.org
Unsubscribe instructions and other list options:
http://lists.jitsi.org/mailman/listinfo/users

--
There are 10 kinds of people in this world, those who understand binary and
those who don't.

mpicher@gmail.com
blog: http://www.sipxecs.info
call: sip:mpicher@sipxecs.info


#7

SIP is the protocol, similar of what SMTP is for email.

You create an account with a service provider, which decides if it interconnects with other providers and how that is done. Even for email, some email service providers accept traffic only when coming from an IP that has a PTR record in DNS or traffic comes over SSL. You can even restrict email communication between users having account on the same email server, just a matter of configuration.

iptel.org should allow peering with other voip networks, same with other open/free sip networks such as openrcs.com, voipuser.org, etc. But again, this is a decision of those people running the service, not a matter of the protocol.

Cheers,
Daniel

···

On 7/12/13 11:03 AM, Ansis Māliņš wrote:

>You can never guarantee that a SIP account will be able to communicate with any other SIP account, for example.

!!!!!!

How can this be?? Isn't SIP the email of VoIP?

--
Daniel-Constantin Mierla - http://www.asipto.com
http://twitter.com/#!/miconda - http://www.linkedin.com/in/miconda


#8

My emphasis was on 'guarantee'. There can always be isolated services which do not allow outside calls.

Regards,
Boris

···

On 7/12/13 12:03 PM, Ansis Māliņš wrote:

>You can never guarantee that a SIP account will be able to communicate
with any other SIP account, for example.

!!!!!!

How can this be?? Isn't SIP the email of VoIP?


#9

Let me summarize and tell me if I got something wrong.

The following 3/10 'networks on the list are SIP servers: 1. ippi 2.
iptel.org 3. SIP

Correct.

The following 7/10 networks on the list are XMPP servers: 1. AIM, 2.
Facebook, 3. Google talk, 4. ICQ, 5. MSN 6. Yahoo! 7. XMPP

Wrong.

Facebook and Google Talk are XMPP.
AIM and ICQ use Oscar
MSN uses the MSN protocol. (They actually also have an XMPP gateway but we are not using it since it offers limited features.)
Yahoo! accounts use the Yahoo! messenger protocol

There are only two general protocols, SIP and XMPP, that all audio/video
peer-to-peer communication operates under.

Yes. Although to be exact, audio/video communication uses the RTP protocol. SIP and XMPP both simply establish RTP sessions.

All SIP providers should fundamentally allow cross communication but may not
(not guaranteed to) since individual providers may put their own
restrictions on it but all SIP servers in the list seem to allow
cross-communication.

Correct.

Is XMPP similar to SIP in that - All XMPP providers should fundamentally
allow cross communication but may not (not guaranteed to) since individual
providers may put their own restrictions on it

This is true yes. The main difference with SIP is that in general, XMPP servers federate a lot more often than others. This is mostly for historical and business reasons.

One example for this is that with SIP, paying for PSTN minutes is a common business model. Hence SIP providers have an incentive to allow for PSTN "federation". SIP federation is ignored at best (because it doesn't bring extra money), explicitly forbidden at worst (because it its not available users are more often forced to the PSTN and generate revenue).

    - BUT it happens to be that in the list the providers seem to NOT allow
cross communication?

As explained, most of the services above don't use XMPP so there can't be any federation. From the XMPP service in there, Facebook is the only one that does not federate.

Hope this helps,
Emil

···

On 12.07.13, 21:15, Joe wrote:

Thanks for the helpful replies.

-----Original Message-----
From: Boris Grozev [mailto:boris@jitsi.org]
Sent: Friday, July 12, 2013 2:48 AM
To: Jitsi Users
Cc: Joe
Subject: Re: [jitsi-users] XMPP vs SIP vs icq vs ippi vs iptel ...

Hello,

On 7/12/13 7:40 AM, Joe wrote:

There are 10 different "networks" in "add new account." What is
confusing to someone like me is what is interoperable with what?

I have an XMPP account.

Can I "add contact" of someone who has a SIP account and be able to a.
text chat b. voice chat and c. video chat with them?

No, you can't do that.

What about with someone who has an

AIM, Facebook, Google talk, ICQ, ippi, iptel.org, MSN (SIP, XMPP
mentioned already)or Yahoo! Account?

The only one that will work is Google Talk. And the current situation with
audio/video calls is...uncertain.

I can get people to install jitsi but it would be easier if I have
them log in with the accounts they already have from other sources -
some won't want to register another username and password.

Can someone give me a grouping of the above 10 network types such that
each subgroup can communicate with all in their own subgroup?

Strictly this isn't possible, because XMPP and SIP are protocols rather than
services. You can never guarantee that a SIP account will be able to
communicate with any other SIP account, for example.

AIM, Facebook, ICQ, MSN and Yahoo! can only talk to each other.

ippi and iptel.org use SIP and seem to work with other SIP services.

Regards,
Boris

_______________________________________________
users mailing list
users@jitsi.org
Unsubscribe instructions and other list options:
http://lists.jitsi.org/mailman/listinfo/users

--
https://jitsi.org


#10

OK thanks.

Based on the responses I received would the following be correct?

All the 10 listed networks support text chat

Only the following 4/10 support voice/video: 1. ippi 2.iptel.org 3. SIP
4.Google talk (the first three using SIP and the last using XMPP)
--Does Jitsi support audio/video over facebook since it is XMPP?

Any network that supports voice also supports video and vice versa.

8/10 networks listed refer to actual servers but 2/10 specifically 'SIP' and
'XMPP' are generic protocol names and the server is specified by the user
during 'add new account.'

From my XMPP account I can 'add contacts' of a google talk user but cannot

add facebook account users since google talk is federated but facebook is
not.

···

-----Original Message-----
From: Emil Ivov [mailto:emcho@jitsi.org]
Sent: Friday, July 12, 2013 7:41 PM
To: Jitsi Users
Cc: Joe
Subject: Re: [jitsi-users] XMPP vs SIP vs icq vs ippi vs iptel ...

On 12.07.13, 21:15, Joe wrote:

Let me summarize and tell me if I got something wrong.

The following 3/10 'networks on the list are SIP servers: 1. ippi 2.
iptel.org 3. SIP

Correct.

The following 7/10 networks on the list are XMPP servers: 1. AIM, 2.
Facebook, 3. Google talk, 4. ICQ, 5. MSN 6. Yahoo! 7. XMPP

Wrong.

Facebook and Google Talk are XMPP.
AIM and ICQ use Oscar
MSN uses the MSN protocol. (They actually also have an XMPP gateway but we
are not using it since it offers limited features.) Yahoo! accounts use the
Yahoo! messenger protocol

There are only two general protocols, SIP and XMPP, that all
audio/video peer-to-peer communication operates under.

Yes. Although to be exact, audio/video communication uses the RTP protocol.
SIP and XMPP both simply establish RTP sessions.

All SIP providers should fundamentally allow cross communication but
may not (not guaranteed to) since individual providers may put their
own restrictions on it but all SIP servers in the list seem to allow
cross-communication.

Correct.

Is XMPP similar to SIP in that - All XMPP providers should
fundamentally allow cross communication but may not (not guaranteed
to) since individual providers may put their own restrictions on it

This is true yes. The main difference with SIP is that in general, XMPP
servers federate a lot more often than others. This is mostly for historical
and business reasons.

One example for this is that with SIP, paying for PSTN minutes is a common
business model. Hence SIP providers have an incentive to allow for PSTN
"federation". SIP federation is ignored at best (because it doesn't bring
extra money), explicitly forbidden at worst (because it its not available
users are more often forced to the PSTN and generate revenue).

    - BUT it happens to be that in the list the providers seem to NOT
allow cross communication?

As explained, most of the services above don't use XMPP so there can't be
any federation. From the XMPP service in there, Facebook is the only one
that does not federate.

Hope this helps,
Emil

Thanks for the helpful replies.

-----Original Message-----
From: Boris Grozev [mailto:boris@jitsi.org]
Sent: Friday, July 12, 2013 2:48 AM
To: Jitsi Users
Cc: Joe
Subject: Re: [jitsi-users] XMPP vs SIP vs icq vs ippi vs iptel ...

Hello,

On 7/12/13 7:40 AM, Joe wrote:

There are 10 different "networks" in "add new account." What is
confusing to someone like me is what is interoperable with what?

I have an XMPP account.

Can I "add contact" of someone who has a SIP account and be able to a.
text chat b. voice chat and c. video chat with them?

No, you can't do that.

What about with someone who has an

AIM, Facebook, Google talk, ICQ, ippi, iptel.org, MSN (SIP, XMPP
mentioned already)or Yahoo! Account?

The only one that will work is Google Talk. And the current situation
with audio/video calls is...uncertain.

I can get people to install jitsi but it would be easier if I have
them log in with the accounts they already have from other sources -
some won't want to register another username and password.

Can someone give me a grouping of the above 10 network types such
that each subgroup can communicate with all in their own subgroup?

Strictly this isn't possible, because XMPP and SIP are protocols
rather than services. You can never guarantee that a SIP account will
be able to communicate with any other SIP account, for example.

AIM, Facebook, ICQ, MSN and Yahoo! can only talk to each other.

ippi and iptel.org use SIP and seem to work with other SIP services.

Regards,
Boris

_______________________________________________
users mailing list
users@jitsi.org
Unsubscribe instructions and other list options:
http://lists.jitsi.org/mailman/listinfo/users

--
https://jitsi.org


#11

Hey Joe,

OK thanks.

Based on the responses I received would the following be correct?

All the 10 listed networks support text chat

Only the following 4/10 support voice/video: 1. ippi 2.iptel.org 3. SIP
4.Google talk (the first three using SIP and the last using XMPP)

If you listed SIP then you probably should also list XMPP

--Does Jitsi support audio/video over facebook since it is XMPP?

Facebook explicitly block this.

Any network that supports voice also supports video and vice versa.

Not necessarily. Although that's mostly true for the above.

8/10 networks listed refer to actual servers but 2/10 specifically 'SIP' and
'XMPP' are generic protocol names and the server is specified by the user
during 'add new account.'

Correct.

From my XMPP account I can 'add contacts' of a google talk user but cannot
add facebook account users since google talk is federated but facebook is
not.

Correct

Emil

···

On Sun, Jul 14, 2013 at 4:34 AM, Joe <js3j@hotmail.com> wrote:

-----Original Message-----
From: Emil Ivov [mailto:emcho@jitsi.org]
Sent: Friday, July 12, 2013 7:41 PM
To: Jitsi Users
Cc: Joe
Subject: Re: [jitsi-users] XMPP vs SIP vs icq vs ippi vs iptel ...

On 12.07.13, 21:15, Joe wrote:

Let me summarize and tell me if I got something wrong.

The following 3/10 'networks on the list are SIP servers: 1. ippi 2.
iptel.org 3. SIP

Correct.

The following 7/10 networks on the list are XMPP servers: 1. AIM, 2.
Facebook, 3. Google talk, 4. ICQ, 5. MSN 6. Yahoo! 7. XMPP

Wrong.

Facebook and Google Talk are XMPP.
AIM and ICQ use Oscar
MSN uses the MSN protocol. (They actually also have an XMPP gateway but we
are not using it since it offers limited features.) Yahoo! accounts use the
Yahoo! messenger protocol

There are only two general protocols, SIP and XMPP, that all
audio/video peer-to-peer communication operates under.

Yes. Although to be exact, audio/video communication uses the RTP protocol.
SIP and XMPP both simply establish RTP sessions.

All SIP providers should fundamentally allow cross communication but
may not (not guaranteed to) since individual providers may put their
own restrictions on it but all SIP servers in the list seem to allow
cross-communication.

Correct.

Is XMPP similar to SIP in that - All XMPP providers should
fundamentally allow cross communication but may not (not guaranteed
to) since individual providers may put their own restrictions on it

This is true yes. The main difference with SIP is that in general, XMPP
servers federate a lot more often than others. This is mostly for historical
and business reasons.

One example for this is that with SIP, paying for PSTN minutes is a common
business model. Hence SIP providers have an incentive to allow for PSTN
"federation". SIP federation is ignored at best (because it doesn't bring
extra money), explicitly forbidden at worst (because it its not available
users are more often forced to the PSTN and generate revenue).

    - BUT it happens to be that in the list the providers seem to NOT
allow cross communication?

As explained, most of the services above don't use XMPP so there can't be
any federation. From the XMPP service in there, Facebook is the only one
that does not federate.

Hope this helps,
Emil

Thanks for the helpful replies.

-----Original Message-----
From: Boris Grozev [mailto:boris@jitsi.org]
Sent: Friday, July 12, 2013 2:48 AM
To: Jitsi Users
Cc: Joe
Subject: Re: [jitsi-users] XMPP vs SIP vs icq vs ippi vs iptel ...

Hello,

On 7/12/13 7:40 AM, Joe wrote:

There are 10 different "networks" in "add new account." What is
confusing to someone like me is what is interoperable with what?

I have an XMPP account.

Can I "add contact" of someone who has a SIP account and be able to a.
text chat b. voice chat and c. video chat with them?

No, you can't do that.

What about with someone who has an

AIM, Facebook, Google talk, ICQ, ippi, iptel.org, MSN (SIP, XMPP
mentioned already)or Yahoo! Account?

The only one that will work is Google Talk. And the current situation
with audio/video calls is...uncertain.

I can get people to install jitsi but it would be easier if I have
them log in with the accounts they already have from other sources -
some won't want to register another username and password.

Can someone give me a grouping of the above 10 network types such
that each subgroup can communicate with all in their own subgroup?

Strictly this isn't possible, because XMPP and SIP are protocols
rather than services. You can never guarantee that a SIP account will
be able to communicate with any other SIP account, for example.

AIM, Facebook, ICQ, MSN and Yahoo! can only talk to each other.

ippi and iptel.org use SIP and seem to work with other SIP services.

Regards,
Boris

_______________________________________________
users mailing list
users@jitsi.org
Unsubscribe instructions and other list options:
http://lists.jitsi.org/mailman/listinfo/users

--
https://jitsi.org

_______________________________________________
users mailing list
users@jitsi.org
Unsubscribe instructions and other list options:
http://lists.jitsi.org/mailman/listinfo/users

--
Emil Ivov, Ph.D. 67000 Strasbourg,
Project Lead France
Jitsi
emcho@jitsi.org PHONE: +33.1.77.62.43.30
https://jitsi.org FAX: +33.1.77.62.47.31


#12

But I recently read that Google has turned XMPP federation off. I haven't
tested it though.


#13

The reason I am asking all these questions and for a comparison is because
the people I communicate with do not use jitsi but use google or facebook or
aim... They are not tech people.

Originally the thought was to get them to install jitsi and not to have to
make them get a new login and password but to use what they already have and
hopefully for me to have one login.
The less new things you ask others to do the more likely they will do it.

It now seems based on all these discussions that it will be difficult (let
me know if these points are correct):
1. there may be future issues with google
2. There is no voice/video with facebook
3. Jitsi cannot communicate with google over the google web application even
non-securely which means I couldn't use jitsi for both secure communication
for those installing jitsi/google and unsecure for the infrequent
communicator over google/web (whom I couldn't get to install jitsi)
4. I could not use only one jitsi login but would need to an account for
each service

So I'm limited to using either an XMPP or SIP account and then to get the
frequent communicators to make a new login/password for themselves on what I
choose.

Now the question is what is the best route if I want good quality
voice/video. Chatting has not been a problem but voice has.
So far I used getonsip XMPP and had one two people set up jit.si. chatting
worked fine but voice and video have been worse quality than using
gmail-gmail (no jitsi).

Before I go further the question is
Should I use XMPP OR SIP if starting fresh and guiding people to establish a
new login account.
Is there a quality difference between the two for
a. chat
b. voice
c. video

Whichever one is chosen - is it important for quality that the others get an
account on the same service/server as me or is that not an issue?

There is something interesting that may tie into this.
Getonsip.com is a free service and when you set up an account it
automatically makes two separate accounts with the same user name/password
one SIP and one XMPP - they both show up on jitsi. Why don't they use one OR
the other?

Jit.si is only XMPP - is that correct?

Any other thoughts?

Thanks.

···

-----Original Message-----
From: users-bounces@jitsi.org [mailto:users-bounces@jitsi.org] On Behalf Of
Emil Ivov
Sent: Sunday, July 14, 2013 8:13 AM
To: Jitsi Users
Subject: Re: [jitsi-users] XMPP vs SIP vs icq vs ippi vs iptel ...

Hey Joe,

On Sun, Jul 14, 2013 at 4:34 AM, Joe <js3j@hotmail.com> wrote:

OK thanks.

Based on the responses I received would the following be correct?

All the 10 listed networks support text chat

Only the following 4/10 support voice/video: 1. ippi 2.iptel.org 3.

SIP

4.Google talk (the first three using SIP and the last using XMPP)

If you listed SIP then you probably should also list XMPP

--Does Jitsi support audio/video over facebook since it is XMPP?

Facebook explicitly block this.

Any network that supports voice also supports video and vice versa.

Not necessarily. Although that's mostly true for the above.

8/10 networks listed refer to actual servers but 2/10 specifically
'SIP' and 'XMPP' are generic protocol names and the server is
specified by the user during 'add new account.'

Correct.

From my XMPP account I can 'add contacts' of a google talk user but
cannot add facebook account users since google talk is federated but
facebook is not.

Correct

Emil

-----Original Message-----
From: Emil Ivov [mailto:emcho@jitsi.org]
Sent: Friday, July 12, 2013 7:41 PM
To: Jitsi Users
Cc: Joe
Subject: Re: [jitsi-users] XMPP vs SIP vs icq vs ippi vs iptel ...

On 12.07.13, 21:15, Joe wrote:

Let me summarize and tell me if I got something wrong.

The following 3/10 'networks on the list are SIP servers: 1. ippi 2.
iptel.org 3. SIP

Correct.

The following 7/10 networks on the list are XMPP servers: 1. AIM, 2.
Facebook, 3. Google talk, 4. ICQ, 5. MSN 6. Yahoo! 7. XMPP

Wrong.

Facebook and Google Talk are XMPP.
AIM and ICQ use Oscar
MSN uses the MSN protocol. (They actually also have an XMPP gateway
but we are not using it since it offers limited features.) Yahoo!
accounts use the Yahoo! messenger protocol

There are only two general protocols, SIP and XMPP, that all
audio/video peer-to-peer communication operates under.

Yes. Although to be exact, audio/video communication uses the RTP

protocol.

SIP and XMPP both simply establish RTP sessions.

All SIP providers should fundamentally allow cross communication but
may not (not guaranteed to) since individual providers may put their
own restrictions on it but all SIP servers in the list seem to allow
cross-communication.

Correct.

Is XMPP similar to SIP in that - All XMPP providers should
fundamentally allow cross communication but may not (not guaranteed
to) since individual providers may put their own restrictions on it

This is true yes. The main difference with SIP is that in general,
XMPP servers federate a lot more often than others. This is mostly for
historical and business reasons.

One example for this is that with SIP, paying for PSTN minutes is a
common business model. Hence SIP providers have an incentive to allow
for PSTN "federation". SIP federation is ignored at best (because it
doesn't bring extra money), explicitly forbidden at worst (because it
its not available users are more often forced to the PSTN and generate

revenue).

    - BUT it happens to be that in the list the providers seem to NOT
allow cross communication?

As explained, most of the services above don't use XMPP so there can't
be any federation. From the XMPP service in there, Facebook is the
only one that does not federate.

Hope this helps,
Emil

Thanks for the helpful replies.

-----Original Message-----
From: Boris Grozev [mailto:boris@jitsi.org]
Sent: Friday, July 12, 2013 2:48 AM
To: Jitsi Users
Cc: Joe
Subject: Re: [jitsi-users] XMPP vs SIP vs icq vs ippi vs iptel ...

Hello,

On 7/12/13 7:40 AM, Joe wrote:

There are 10 different "networks" in "add new account." What is
confusing to someone like me is what is interoperable with what?

I have an XMPP account.

Can I "add contact" of someone who has a SIP account and be able to a.
text chat b. voice chat and c. video chat with them?

No, you can't do that.

What about with someone who has an

AIM, Facebook, Google talk, ICQ, ippi, iptel.org, MSN (SIP, XMPP
mentioned already)or Yahoo! Account?

The only one that will work is Google Talk. And the current situation
with audio/video calls is...uncertain.

I can get people to install jitsi but it would be easier if I have
them log in with the accounts they already have from other sources -
some won't want to register another username and password.

Can someone give me a grouping of the above 10 network types such
that each subgroup can communicate with all in their own subgroup?

Strictly this isn't possible, because XMPP and SIP are protocols
rather than services. You can never guarantee that a SIP account will
be able to communicate with any other SIP account, for example.

AIM, Facebook, ICQ, MSN and Yahoo! can only talk to each other.

ippi and iptel.org use SIP and seem to work with other SIP services.

Regards,
Boris

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#14

It now seems based on all these discussions that it will be
difficult (let me know if these points are correct): 1. there may
be future issues with google

Exactly, we can not be shure how google as a company decides to be
(in)compatible with the rest of the world, additionaly there are lots
of reports about failed video with google.

2. There is no voice/video with facebook

the most important point is that there is no federation over facebook,
so everybody would need to use facebook.com as their server. i think
that video communication would be possible in theory

3. Jitsi cannot communicate with google over the google web
application even non-securely which means I couldn't use jitsi for
both secure communication for those installing jitsi/google and
unsecure for the infrequent communicator over google/web (whom I
couldn't get to install jitsi)

exactly, there is some hope that this might change with the
standartisation of webrtc but that is not shure at all

4. I could not use only one jitsi login but would need to an
account for each service

It depends: you just need one account in the free XMPP network (this
excludes facebook) and you can communicate with everybody in it (just
like email). You do need aim/facebook/whatever accounts to use those
networks.

So I'm limited to using either an XMPP or SIP account and then to
get the frequent communicators to make a new login/password for
themselves on what I choose.

On the server you choose or any other federating XMPP server. For sip
this is a bit more complicated, additionaly jitsi does not support ice
for sip which is a major showstopper when your sip provider does not
provide a relay.

Now the question is what is the best route if I want good quality
voice/video. Chatting has not been a problem but voice has. So far
I used getonsip XMPP and had one two people set up jit.si.
chatting worked fine but voice and video have been worse quality
than using gmail-gmail (no jitsi).

No real idea about this� maybee your cpu is overloaded from encrypting
and encoding the video?

Before I go further the question is Should I use XMPP OR SIP if
starting fresh and guiding people to establish a new login account.

I would recommend using XMPP as the XMPP network is generaly better
federated then the SIP network (they make money by selling POTS so it
would make no sense to provide good connectivity oven non-POTS lines)
and jitsi supports ICE on XMPP.

Is there a quality difference between the two for a. chat

i am not exactly shure about this but i think XMPP is better with
multiple simultanous logins from multiple devices and presence
information.

b. voice c. video

Should be more or less the same for both protocols.
But, due to ICE and jingle nodes XMPP has the better connectivity
without requiring the server owner to run an expensive relay

Whichever one is chosen - is it important for quality that the
others get an account on the same service/server as me or is that
not an issue?

see above, but i should mention that some XMPP servers have some
federation problems from time to time. for example jit.si itself has
such problems for a month now. on the other hand jit.si provides a
jinglenodes relay which helps a lot when you both are behind
restrictive nats. some other servers do so, too but not all.

There is something interesting that may tie into this. Getonsip.com
is a free service and when you set up an account it automatically
makes two separate accounts with the same user name/password one
SIP and one XMPP - they both show up on jitsi. Why don't they use
one OR the other?

Because there are some severs using sip and some using XMPP. as the
protcols are not compatible you would be unable to connect to people
on the other network.

Jit.si is only XMPP - is that correct?

yes

Any other thoughts?

about the video/audio quality: check the settings for video and audio
codecs and experiment a bit.

Thanks.

- --
Yannik V�lker

···

Am 17.07.2013 17:34, schrieb Joe: