[jitsi-dev] [jitsi] Support for omemo (#199)


#1

That would be nice

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#2

What is that?

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#3

@ibauersachs: an e2e encryption thing:
http://xmpp.org/extensions/inbox/omemo.html -- see also some recent discussion on standards@xmpp.org

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#4

I was looking for an xmpp based alternative to Text Secure/Signal. And found this blog:
http://www.titus-stahl.de/blog/2015/09/15/how-to-get-secure-decentralized-chat-working-with-xmpp-both-on-mobile-and-desktop/

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#5

this would be great, there is no desktop client that supports OMEMO
normal OTR from desktop -> phone is not the best UX.

also, all the desktop clients from whatsapp and singal need a phonenumber and a smartphone to activate an account -> horrible.

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#6

I just came over from [Freedesktop’s Bugzilla for Telepathy’s XMPP component (gabble)](https://bugs.freedesktop.org/show_bug.cgi?id=93090) and while [they also have a bug for it](https://bugs.freedesktop.org/show_bug.cgi?id=93090), the [KDE developers downstream don’t expect much from them](https://bugs.kde.org/show_bug.cgi?id=355423). So Jitsi is probably our only hope for now.

(It it would enable chatting with Signal/TextSecure/Axolotl users, that would be the single greatest thing for desktop messaging as of now.)

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#7

This would need to come from the community, we simply don't have the resources to develop this.

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#8

there is work on a Gajim Plugin https://github.com/kalkin/gajim-omemo
it already works for me.

@Evi1M4chine how do you think this would enable chatting with Signal or TextSecure Apps?
even if it is the same tech behind it, the companys behind it would have to allow it, if this was possible i think many people already would have made desktop apps for it.

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#9

The implementation contained in https://github.com/siacs/Conversations could also be portable. It's Java on Android, but I got no clue about the libraries used. Any chance to get the developers of these projects to make a common backend and provide their distinct UIs on top of that or something? There was a Jitsi on Android initiative anyways, right? The UI and design principles of Conversations make a really good impression, if you don't know it maybe take a look. It's chat-only though, i.e. without VoIP. Pictures in chats are a killer-feature, imho. Getting that and the OMEMO goodies working between the two (no matter if with common backend or not) would be really awesome.

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#10

##### @lovetox:
Why would you think they couldn’t? The protocol is the same, so it’s only a matter of picking the same server to connect to. But you don’t even have to do that, since Signal’s server, being just an XMPP one with Axolotl/Omemo added in, supports federation (which is already used, e.g. with CyanogenMod’s builtin SMS/messaging app).
I also made a Signal fork this morning. Other than warnings about chat partners having different keys there were no problems. So obviously the “companies* behind it” don’t prevent it.

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\* Which I assume are not criminals/psychopaths and hence don’t employ nasty anti-social behavior like exclusivism or trying to corporate-murder each other.

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##### @improti:
Signal (formerly TextSecure) itself is already Android/Java. I don’t think it’s a problem to take any necessary code from there. It’s more a problem of: Who wants to do it?

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#11

OMEMO could be significant: The Axolotl ratchet is the much improved and widely used (see WhatsApp and several others) successor to OTR. Now OMEMO integrates this directly into XMPP, so no more of the criticism of operating on the wrong layer of the protocol stack, which hurdled adoption (see Empathy/Telepathy) and is connected to usability problems of OTR.

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#12

Frankly, without OMEMO, there is no point in even using an IM client. OTR is unacceptable from a usability and design standpoint, and IM clients without push abilities plainly can’t work on mobile devices without dragging down the battery or not receiving messages.
So this is really the only choice. And Axolotl/OMEMO is apparently a rather nice implementation.
Which is why it is rapidly becoming the standard.
So any IM client who can’t do OMEMO, soon won’t be compatible with anything… especially not federated mobile XMPP clients.
If I can do anything about it, I won’t even allow non-OMEMO connections on my server or any client I might write or use, to show a big middle finger to any state terrorists (aka “intelligence” agencies, etc).

So, even more frankly, this is simply a question of life and death for Jitsi.
No OMEMO, and you could as well close down now, instead of letting it rot to a slow unavoidable [digital donkey](http://thedailywtf.com/articles/Virtudyne_0x3a__The_Digital_Donkey) undeath.

The only thing I am ashamed of, is that I have so little resources to give, to support your great software.

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#13

An implementation of OMEMO for XMPP is available (in Java) in the referenced project (https://github.com/siacs/Conversations). I'd very much like to see that becoming used in Jitsi (as well as the Jitsi ZRTP over XMPP becoming used in Conversations). I cannot do that atm due to large overhead involved (I know neither of the projects code-wise). But could you please try to get in touch with them and see if you guys can help each other here? Maybe drop a note in https://github.com/siacs/Conversations/issues/1646 or something? It might actually be a rather small task if you could exchange code/knowledge here?

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#14

Just like it was already mentioned by the devs -- yes, OMEMO is nice thing, but the code has to come from the community. Jitsi is a big project, with lot of work there to maintain it and believe me, the devs won't reject a good code attribution.

So once again, it's "talk is cheap, show me the code".

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#15

@turing: Here is the code: https://github.com/siacs/Conversations/tree/master/src/main/java/eu/siacs/conversations/crypto/axolotl - as said, I have no clue how Jitsi is build and how to go and integrate it (as I do not know how it is used there) :frowning: If you tell me what info you need I would actually go and try to get it for you, although I think a direct exchange between you guys would be far more effective (and could yield synergies in the future as well?).

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#16

@improti i think you misunderstanding him.

its not a question of information to make this possible, like you are trying to provide.
its a question of having the time to implement it.

it seems that the developers dont have time, even if it is a great feature.
so he is asking for a code contribution, someone from outside of the current development team to make that contribution.

so if you cant code it yourself or get someone else to code it, you simply cant help.

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#17

Hi,
any new information regarding the case about the OMEMO support?

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#18

I'm not even capable of maintaining the existing features. So, no.

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#19

Maybe there needs to be a bug about creating a funding campaign? :slight_smile:

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#20

I'd love to see OMEMO being supported by Jitsi.

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