[jitsi-dev] HD video and small bandwidth


#1

Hi,

I'm still thinking about ways to have best possible video with small upload
bandwidth (~1Mbit/s).
Simulcast is great for high bandwidth and really high resolution, but for
low bandwidth you send 1250kbits (minimum bandwidth for 3 layers
simulcasts) for other participant to receive ~650kbits, which is a lot of
wasted bandwidth.

I would like to add an option to keep the vignette (so that it display the
name, the mic, and glow when someone talk) but just don't show the small
video (also disabling simulcast), so that every participant send an hd
stream, and receive only one hd stream, nothing more. (i'm using
x-google-max-bitrate and chrome only)
Do you think it's feasible? (some hints appreciated :slight_smile: )

Regards
Etienne


#2

Hi Etienne, I’m not sure I understand the feature you would like to have. Isn’t what you’re asking equivalent to disabling simulcast and configuring the resolution to be ‘720’ (both options are in config.js)? - George

···

On Apr 26, 2016, at 11:28 AM, Etienne Champetier <champetier.etienne@gmail.com> wrote:

Hi,

I'm still thinking about ways to have best possible video with small upload bandwidth (~1Mbit/s).
Simulcast is great for high bandwidth and really high resolution, but for low bandwidth you send 1250kbits (minimum bandwidth for 3 layers simulcasts) for other participant to receive ~650kbits, which is a lot of wasted bandwidth.

I would like to add an option to keep the vignette (so that it display the name, the mic, and glow when someone talk) but just don't show the small video (also disabling simulcast), so that every participant send an hd stream, and receive only one hd stream, nothing more. (i'm using x-google-max-bitrate and chrome only)
Do you think it's feasible? (some hints appreciated :slight_smile: )

Regards
Etienne
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#3

You should be able to achieve this with lastN=1, in which case you can just disable simulcast (or keep it for the short-circuit logic which disables HD).

Boris

···

On 26/04/16 11:28, Etienne Champetier wrote:

Hi,

I'm still thinking about ways to have best possible video with small
upload bandwidth (~1Mbit/s).
Simulcast is great for high bandwidth and really high resolution, but
for low bandwidth you send 1250kbits (minimum bandwidth for 3 layers
simulcasts) for other participant to receive ~650kbits, which is a lot
of wasted bandwidth.

I would like to add an option to keep the vignette (so that it display
the name, the mic, and glow when someone talk) but just don't show the
small video (also disabling simulcast), so that every participant send
an hd stream, and receive only one hd stream, nothing more. (i'm using
x-google-max-bitrate and chrome only)
Do you think it's feasible? (some hints appreciated :slight_smile: )


#4

Hi,

I'm still thinking about ways to have best possible video with small
upload bandwidth (~1Mbit/s).
Simulcast is great for high bandwidth and really high resolution, but
for low bandwidth you send 1250kbits (minimum bandwidth for 3 layers
simulcasts) for other participant to receive ~650kbits, which is a lot
of wasted bandwidth.

I would like to add an option to keep the vignette

Not sure what vignette means (a French word maybe?). Do you mean thumbnail?

(so that it display
the name, the mic, and glow when someone talk) but just don't show the
small video (also disabling simulcast), so that every participant send
an hd stream, and receive only one hd stream, nothing more. (i'm using
x-google-max-bitrate and chrome only)
Do you think it's feasible? (some hints appreciated :slight_smile: )

Sounds like you just want to disable simulcast. Why don't you simply do this?

Emil

···

On 26.04.16 г. 11:28, Etienne Champetier wrote:

--
https://jitsi.org


#5

Hi,

I'm still thinking about ways to have best possible video with small
upload bandwidth (~1Mbit/s).
Simulcast is great for high bandwidth and really high resolution, but
for low bandwidth you send 1250kbits (minimum bandwidth for 3 layers
simulcasts) for other participant to receive ~650kbits, which is a lot
of wasted bandwidth.

I would like to add an option to keep the vignette

Not sure what vignette means (a French word maybe?). Do you mean

thumbnail?

(so that it display
the name, the mic, and glow when someone talk) but just don't show the
small video (also disabling simulcast), so that every participant send
an hd stream, and receive only one hd stream, nothing more. (i'm using
x-google-max-bitrate and chrome only)
Do you think it's feasible? (some hints appreciated :slight_smile: )

Sounds like you just want to disable simulcast. Why don't you simply do

this?

Without simulcast if you are 5 you receive 4 HD stream, thus killing your
download

···

Le 26 avr. 2016 6:38 PM, "Emil Ivov" <emcho@jitsi.org> a écrit :

On 26.04.16 г. 11:28, Etienne Champetier wrote:

Emil

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#6

Hi,

I'm still thinking about ways to have best possible video with small
upload bandwidth (~1Mbit/s).
Simulcast is great for high bandwidth and really high resolution, but
for low bandwidth you send 1250kbits (minimum bandwidth for 3 layers
simulcasts) for other participant to receive ~650kbits, which is a lot
of wasted bandwidth.

I would like to add an option to keep the vignette (so that it display
the name, the mic, and glow when someone talk) but just don't show the
small video (also disabling simulcast), so that every participant send
an hd stream, and receive only one hd stream, nothing more. (i'm using
x-google-max-bitrate and chrome only)
Do you think it's feasible? (some hints appreciated :slight_smile: )

You should be able to achieve this with lastN=1, in which case you can

just disable simulcast (or keep it for the short-circuit logic which
disables HD).

lastN=1 prevent you from seeing another participant than the main speaker,
and remove the thumbnail which enable you to see who is speaking
Also isn't lastN disabling non lastN video?

···

Le 26 avr. 2016 6:37 PM, "Boris Grozev" <boris@jitsi.org> a écrit :

On 26/04/16 11:28, Etienne Champetier wrote:

Boris

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#7

>
>>
>> Hi,
>>
>> I'm still thinking about ways to have best possible video with small
>> upload bandwidth (~1Mbit/s).
>> Simulcast is great for high bandwidth and really high resolution, but
>> for low bandwidth you send 1250kbits (minimum bandwidth for 3 layers
>> simulcasts) for other participant to receive ~650kbits, which is a lot
>> of wasted bandwidth.
>>
>> I would like to add an option to keep the vignette
>
> Not sure what vignette means (a French word maybe?). Do you mean
thumbnail?
>
>> (so that it display
>> the name, the mic, and glow when someone talk) but just don't show the
>> small video (also disabling simulcast), so that every participant send
>> an hd stream, and receive only one hd stream, nothing more. (i'm using
>> x-google-max-bitrate and chrome only)
>> Do you think it's feasible? (some hints appreciated :slight_smile: )
>
> Sounds like you just want to disable simulcast. Why don't you simply
do this?

Without simulcast if you are 5 you receive 4 HD stream, thus killing
your download

Not exactly. What you are describing is the behaviour you get when you disable simulcast and enable RTCP termnation ... and you should never do this.

Disabling simulcast *and* RTCP termination basically means that everyone adapts to the crappiest receiver.

Emil

···

On 26.04.16 г. 11:43, Etienne Champetier wrote:

Le 26 avr. 2016 6:38 PM, "Emil Ivov" <emcho@jitsi.org > <mailto:emcho@jitsi.org>> a écrit :
> On 26.04.16 г. 11:28, Etienne Champetier wrote:

>
> Emil
>
> --
> https://jitsi.org
>
> _______________________________________________
> dev mailing list
> dev@jitsi.org <mailto:dev@jitsi.org>
> Unsubscribe instructions and other list options:
> http://lists.jitsi.org/mailman/listinfo/dev

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#8

>
>>
>> Hi,
>>
>> I'm still thinking about ways to have best possible video with small
>> upload bandwidth (~1Mbit/s).
>> Simulcast is great for high bandwidth and really high resolution, but
>> for low bandwidth you send 1250kbits (minimum bandwidth for 3 layers
>> simulcasts) for other participant to receive ~650kbits, which is a lot
>> of wasted bandwidth.
>>
>> I would like to add an option to keep the vignette (so that it display
>> the name, the mic, and glow when someone talk) but just don't show the
>> small video (also disabling simulcast), so that every participant send
>> an hd stream, and receive only one hd stream, nothing more. (i'm using
>> x-google-max-bitrate and chrome only)
>> Do you think it's feasible? (some hints appreciated :slight_smile: )
>
> You should be able to achieve this with lastN=1, in which case you
can just disable simulcast (or keep it for the short-circuit logic which
disables HD).

lastN=1 prevent you from seeing another participant than the main
speaker, and remove the thumbnail which enable you to see who is speaking
Also isn't lastN disabling non lastN video?

Exactly, isn't this what you meant with "receive only one hd stream, nothing more"? If you want to receive one HD stream for the speaker (and no low quality streams for the speaker) and low quality (and no HD) for each non-speaker, then this is exactly what simulcast does. The only waste is on the sending side.

Boris

···

On 26/04/16 11:50, Etienne Champetier wrote:

Le 26 avr. 2016 6:37 PM, "Boris Grozev" <boris@jitsi.org > <mailto:boris@jitsi.org>> a écrit :
> On 26/04/16 11:28, Etienne Champetier wrote:

>
> Boris
>
> _______________________________________________
> dev mailing list
> dev@jitsi.org <mailto:dev@jitsi.org>
> Unsubscribe instructions and other list options:
> http://lists.jitsi.org/mailman/listinfo/dev

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#9

>
>
>
>>
>> Hi,
>>
>> I'm still thinking about ways to have best possible video with small
>> upload bandwidth (~1Mbit/s).
>> Simulcast is great for high bandwidth and really high resolution, but
>> for low bandwidth you send 1250kbits (minimum bandwidth for 3 layers
>> simulcasts) for other participant to receive ~650kbits, which is a

lot

>> of wasted bandwidth.
>>
>> I would like to add an option to keep the vignette
>
>
> Not sure what vignette means (a French word maybe?). Do you mean
thumbnail?
>
>
>> (so that it display
>> the name, the mic, and glow when someone talk) but just don't show

the

>> small video (also disabling simulcast), so that every participant

send

>> an hd stream, and receive only one hd stream, nothing more. (i'm

using

>> x-google-max-bitrate and chrome only)
>> Do you think it's feasible? (some hints appreciated :slight_smile: )
>
>
> Sounds like you just want to disable simulcast. Why don't you simply
do this?

Without simulcast if you are 5 you receive 4 HD stream, thus killing
your download

Not exactly. What you are describing is the behaviour you get when you

disable simulcast and enable RTCP termnation ... and you should never do
this.

Disabling simulcast *and* RTCP termination basically means that everyone

adapts to the crappiest receiver.

Still the crappiest receiver receive 4 as big as possible stream, instead
of 1 (in what i want)

···

Le 26 avr. 2016 6:48 PM, "Emil Ivov" <emcho@jitsi.org> a écrit :

On 26.04.16 г. 11:43, Etienne Champetier wrote:

Le 26 avr. 2016 6:38 PM, "Emil Ivov" <emcho@jitsi.org >> <mailto:emcho@jitsi.org>> a écrit :
> On 26.04.16 г. 11:28, Etienne Champetier wrote:

Emil

>
> Emil
>
> --
> https://jitsi.org
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> dev mailing list
> dev@jitsi.org <mailto:dev@jitsi.org>

> Unsubscribe instructions and other list options:
> http://lists.jitsi.org/mailman/listinfo/dev

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#10

>
>>
>> Hi,
>>
>> I'm still thinking about ways to have best possible video with small
>> upload bandwidth (~1Mbit/s).
>> Simulcast is great for high bandwidth and really high resolution, but
>> for low bandwidth you send 1250kbits (minimum bandwidth for 3 layers
>> simulcasts) for other participant to receive ~650kbits, which is a

lot

>> of wasted bandwidth.
>>
>> I would like to add an option to keep the vignette (so that it

display

>> the name, the mic, and glow when someone talk) but just don't show

the

>> small video (also disabling simulcast), so that every participant

send

>> an hd stream, and receive only one hd stream, nothing more. (i'm

using

>> x-google-max-bitrate and chrome only)
>> Do you think it's feasible? (some hints appreciated :slight_smile: )
>
>
> You should be able to achieve this with lastN=1, in which case you
can just disable simulcast (or keep it for the short-circuit logic which
disables HD).

lastN=1 prevent you from seeing another participant than the main
speaker, and remove the thumbnail which enable you to see who is speaking
Also isn't lastN disabling non lastN video?

Exactly, isn't this what you meant with "receive only one hd stream,

nothing more"? If you want to receive one HD stream for the speaker (and no
low quality streams for the speaker) and low quality (and no HD) for each
non-speaker, then this is exactly what simulcast does. The only waste is on
the sending side.

I don't want any waste on the sending side, so consider simulcast out, what
can i do to keep the thumbnail but without video in it, so that i'm not
limited but receive side?

···

Le 26 avr. 2016 6:58 PM, "Boris Grozev" <boris@jitsi.org> a écrit :

On 26/04/16 11:50, Etienne Champetier wrote:

Le 26 avr. 2016 6:37 PM, "Boris Grozev" <boris@jitsi.org >> <mailto:boris@jitsi.org>> a écrit :
> On 26/04/16 11:28, Etienne Champetier wrote:

Boris

>
> Boris
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> dev mailing list
> dev@jitsi.org <mailto:dev@jitsi.org>

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#11

>
>>
>> Hi,
>>
>> I'm still thinking about ways to have best possible video with small
>> upload bandwidth (~1Mbit/s).
>> Simulcast is great for high bandwidth and really high resolution, but
>> for low bandwidth you send 1250kbits (minimum bandwidth for 3 layers
>> simulcasts) for other participant to receive ~650kbits, which is a

lot

>> of wasted bandwidth.
>>
>> I would like to add an option to keep the vignette (so that it

display

>> the name, the mic, and glow when someone talk) but just don't show

the

>> small video (also disabling simulcast), so that every participant

send

>> an hd stream, and receive only one hd stream, nothing more. (i'm

using

>> x-google-max-bitrate and chrome only)
>> Do you think it's feasible? (some hints appreciated :slight_smile: )
>
>
> You should be able to achieve this with lastN=1, in which case you
can just disable simulcast (or keep it for the short-circuit logic which
disables HD).

lastN=1 prevent you from seeing another participant than the main
speaker, and remove the thumbnail which enable you to see who is speaking
Also isn't lastN disabling non lastN video?

What i mean here is "does non lastN participant stop sending video, thus
video need to ramp up each time we switch?"

Exactly, isn't this what you meant with "receive only one hd stream,

nothing more"? If you want to receive one HD stream for the speaker (and no
low quality streams for the speaker) and low quality (and no HD) for each
non-speaker, then this is exactly what simulcast does. The only waste is on
the sending side.

···

Le 26 avr. 2016 6:58 PM, "Boris Grozev" <boris@jitsi.org> a écrit :

On 26/04/16 11:50, Etienne Champetier wrote:

Le 26 avr. 2016 6:37 PM, "Boris Grozev" <boris@jitsi.org >> <mailto:boris@jitsi.org>> a écrit :
> On 26/04/16 11:28, Etienne Champetier wrote:

Boris

>
> Boris
>
>
> _______________________________________________
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#12

You could set lastN=1, and modify the client to show the thumbnail, but no video.

Boris

···

On 26/04/16 12:04, Etienne Champetier wrote:

Le 26 avr. 2016 6:58 PM, "Boris Grozev" <boris@jitsi.org > <mailto:boris@jitsi.org>> a écrit :
>
> On 26/04/16 11:50, Etienne Champetier wrote:
>>
>> Le 26 avr. 2016 6:37 PM, "Boris Grozev" <boris@jitsi.org > <mailto:boris@jitsi.org> > >> <mailto:boris@jitsi.org <mailto:boris@jitsi.org>>> a écrit :
>>
>> >
>> > On 26/04/16 11:28, Etienne Champetier wrote:
>> >>
>> >> Hi,
>> >>
>> >> I'm still thinking about ways to have best possible video with small
>> >> upload bandwidth (~1Mbit/s).
>> >> Simulcast is great for high bandwidth and really high
resolution, but
>> >> for low bandwidth you send 1250kbits (minimum bandwidth for 3 layers
>> >> simulcasts) for other participant to receive ~650kbits, which is
a lot
>> >> of wasted bandwidth.
>> >>
>> >> I would like to add an option to keep the vignette (so that it
display
>> >> the name, the mic, and glow when someone talk) but just don't
show the
>> >> small video (also disabling simulcast), so that every
participant send
>> >> an hd stream, and receive only one hd stream, nothing more. (i'm
using
>> >> x-google-max-bitrate and chrome only)
>> >> Do you think it's feasible? (some hints appreciated :slight_smile: )
>> >
>> > You should be able to achieve this with lastN=1, in which case you
>> can just disable simulcast (or keep it for the short-circuit logic which
>> disables HD).
>>
>> lastN=1 prevent you from seeing another participant than the main
>> speaker, and remove the thumbnail which enable you to see who is
speaking
>> Also isn't lastN disabling non lastN video?
>
> Exactly, isn't this what you meant with "receive only one hd stream,
nothing more"? If you want to receive one HD stream for the speaker (and
no low quality streams for the speaker) and low quality (and no HD) for
each non-speaker, then this is exactly what simulcast does. The only
waste is on the sending side.

I don't want any waste on the sending side, so consider simulcast out,
what can i do to keep the thumbnail but without video in it, so that i'm
not limited but receive side?


#13

>
>>
>> >
>> >>
>> >> Hi,
>> >>
>> >> I'm still thinking about ways to have best possible video with small
>> >> upload bandwidth (~1Mbit/s).
>> >> Simulcast is great for high bandwidth and really high
resolution, but
>> >> for low bandwidth you send 1250kbits (minimum bandwidth for 3 layers
>> >> simulcasts) for other participant to receive ~650kbits, which is
a lot
>> >> of wasted bandwidth.
>> >>
>> >> I would like to add an option to keep the vignette
>> >
>> > Not sure what vignette means (a French word maybe?). Do you mean
>> thumbnail?
>> >
>> >> (so that it display
>> >> the name, the mic, and glow when someone talk) but just don't
show the
>> >> small video (also disabling simulcast), so that every
participant send
>> >> an hd stream, and receive only one hd stream, nothing more. (i'm
using
>> >> x-google-max-bitrate and chrome only)
>> >> Do you think it's feasible? (some hints appreciated :slight_smile: )
>> >
>> > Sounds like you just want to disable simulcast. Why don't you simply
>> do this?
>>
>> Without simulcast if you are 5 you receive 4 HD stream, thus killing
>> your download
>
> Not exactly. What you are describing is the behaviour you get when
you disable simulcast and enable RTCP termnation ... and you should
never do this.
>
> Disabling simulcast *and* RTCP termination basically means that
everyone adapts to the crappiest receiver.

Still the crappiest receiver receive 4 as big as possible stream,
instead of 1 (in what i want)

I am confused. In your response to Boris you said you didn't want a single stream ... If you do then, on the bridge, LastN is what does that for you. The rest is GUI.

Emil

···

On 26.04.16 г. 11:59, Etienne Champetier wrote:

Le 26 avr. 2016 6:48 PM, "Emil Ivov" <emcho@jitsi.org > <mailto:emcho@jitsi.org>> a écrit :
> On 26.04.16 г. 11:43, Etienne Champetier wrote:
>> Le 26 avr. 2016 6:38 PM, "Emil Ivov" <emcho@jitsi.org > <mailto:emcho@jitsi.org> > >> <mailto:emcho@jitsi.org <mailto:emcho@jitsi.org>>> a écrit :
>> > On 26.04.16 г. 11:28, Etienne Champetier wrote:

>
> Emil
>>
>> >
>> > Emil
>> >
>> > --
>> > https://jitsi.org
>> >
>> > _______________________________________________
>> > dev mailing list
>> > dev@jitsi.org <mailto:dev@jitsi.org> <mailto:dev@jitsi.org
<mailto:dev@jitsi.org>>
>>
>> > Unsubscribe instructions and other list options:
>> > http://lists.jitsi.org/mailman/listinfo/dev
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> dev mailing list
>> dev@jitsi.org <mailto:dev@jitsi.org>
>> Unsubscribe instructions and other list options:
>> http://lists.jitsi.org/mailman/listinfo/dev
>>
>
> --
> https://jitsi.org
>
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#14

>
>>
>>

>>
>> >
>> >>
>> >> Hi,
>> >>
>> >> I'm still thinking about ways to have best possible video with

small

>> >> upload bandwidth (~1Mbit/s).
>> >> Simulcast is great for high bandwidth and really high
resolution, but
>> >> for low bandwidth you send 1250kbits (minimum bandwidth for 3

layers

>> >> simulcasts) for other participant to receive ~650kbits, which is
a lot
>> >> of wasted bandwidth.
>> >>
>> >> I would like to add an option to keep the vignette (so that it
display
>> >> the name, the mic, and glow when someone talk) but just don't
show the
>> >> small video (also disabling simulcast), so that every
participant send
>> >> an hd stream, and receive only one hd stream, nothing more. (i'm
using
>> >> x-google-max-bitrate and chrome only)
>> >> Do you think it's feasible? (some hints appreciated :slight_smile: )
>> >
>> >
>> > You should be able to achieve this with lastN=1, in which case you
>> can just disable simulcast (or keep it for the short-circuit logic

which

>> disables HD).
>>
>> lastN=1 prevent you from seeing another participant than the main
>> speaker, and remove the thumbnail which enable you to see who is
speaking
>> Also isn't lastN disabling non lastN video?
>
>
> Exactly, isn't this what you meant with "receive only one hd stream,
nothing more"? If you want to receive one HD stream for the speaker (and
no low quality streams for the speaker) and low quality (and no HD) for
each non-speaker, then this is exactly what simulcast does. The only
waste is on the sending side.

I don't want any waste on the sending side, so consider simulcast out,
what can i do to keep the thumbnail but without video in it, so that i'm
not limited but receive side?

You could set lastN=1, and modify the client to show the thumbnail, but

no video.

Does non lastN participant stop sending video? (Thus video/connection need
to ramp up each time)

···

Le 26 avr. 2016 7:41 PM, "Boris Grozev" <boris@jitsi.org> a écrit :

On 26/04/16 12:04, Etienne Champetier wrote:

Le 26 avr. 2016 6:58 PM, "Boris Grozev" <boris@jitsi.org >> >> <mailto:boris@jitsi.org>> a écrit :
> On 26/04/16 11:50, Etienne Champetier wrote:
>> Le 26 avr. 2016 6:37 PM, "Boris Grozev" <boris@jitsi.org >> <mailto:boris@jitsi.org> >> >> <mailto:boris@jitsi.org <mailto:boris@jitsi.org>>> a écrit :
>> > On 26/04/16 11:28, Etienne Champetier wrote:

Boris

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#15

If what you're asking is:

"If in last-n mode, does a sending client who is not currently being sent
as part of the last-n group have to restart their bandwidth ramp up when
they become part of the last-n again", the answer is no; they keep sending
to the bridge so the bitrate adaption is continuous.

-brian

···

On Tue, Apr 26, 2016 at 10:56 AM, Etienne Champetier < champetier.etienne@gmail.com> wrote:

Le 26 avr. 2016 7:41 PM, "Boris Grozev" <boris@jitsi.org> a écrit :
>
> On 26/04/16 12:04, Etienne Champetier wrote:
>>
>> Le 26 avr. 2016 6:58 PM, "Boris Grozev" <boris@jitsi.org > >> > >> <mailto:boris@jitsi.org>> a écrit :
>> >
>> > On 26/04/16 11:50, Etienne Champetier wrote:
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> Le 26 avr. 2016 6:37 PM, "Boris Grozev" <boris@jitsi.org > >> <mailto:boris@jitsi.org> > >> >> <mailto:boris@jitsi.org <mailto:boris@jitsi.org>>> a écrit :
>>
>> >>
>> >> >
>> >> > On 26/04/16 11:28, Etienne Champetier wrote:
>> >> >>
>> >> >> Hi,
>> >> >>
>> >> >> I'm still thinking about ways to have best possible video with
small
>> >> >> upload bandwidth (~1Mbit/s).
>> >> >> Simulcast is great for high bandwidth and really high
>> resolution, but
>> >> >> for low bandwidth you send 1250kbits (minimum bandwidth for 3
layers
>> >> >> simulcasts) for other participant to receive ~650kbits, which is
>> a lot
>> >> >> of wasted bandwidth.
>> >> >>
>> >> >> I would like to add an option to keep the vignette (so that it
>> display
>> >> >> the name, the mic, and glow when someone talk) but just don't
>> show the
>> >> >> small video (also disabling simulcast), so that every
>> participant send
>> >> >> an hd stream, and receive only one hd stream, nothing more. (i'm
>> using
>> >> >> x-google-max-bitrate and chrome only)
>> >> >> Do you think it's feasible? (some hints appreciated :slight_smile: )
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >> > You should be able to achieve this with lastN=1, in which case
you
>> >> can just disable simulcast (or keep it for the short-circuit logic
which
>> >> disables HD).
>> >>
>> >> lastN=1 prevent you from seeing another participant than the main
>> >> speaker, and remove the thumbnail which enable you to see who is
>> speaking
>> >> Also isn't lastN disabling non lastN video?
>> >
>> >
>> > Exactly, isn't this what you meant with "receive only one hd stream,
>> nothing more"? If you want to receive one HD stream for the speaker (and
>> no low quality streams for the speaker) and low quality (and no HD) for
>> each non-speaker, then this is exactly what simulcast does. The only
>> waste is on the sending side.
>>
>> I don't want any waste on the sending side, so consider simulcast out,
>> what can i do to keep the thumbnail but without video in it, so that i'm
>> not limited but receive side?
>
>
> You could set lastN=1, and modify the client to show the thumbnail, but
no video.

Does non lastN participant stop sending video? (Thus video/connection need
to ramp up each time)

>
>
> Boris
>
> _______________________________________________
> dev mailing list
> dev@jitsi.org
> Unsubscribe instructions and other list options:
> http://lists.jitsi.org/mailman/listinfo/dev

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#16

If what you're asking is:

"If in last-n mode, does a sending client who is not currently being sent

as part of the last-n group have to restart their bandwidth ramp up when
they become part of the last-n again", the answer is no; they keep sending
to the bridge so the bitrate adaption is continuous.

Thanks,
I will use lastN=1 then (and adapt gui a bit)

Thanks all and sorry for the misunderstanding

-brian

>
>>
>> >
>> >>
>> >>
>>
>> >>
>> >> >
>> >> >>
>> >> >> Hi,
>> >> >>
>> >> >> I'm still thinking about ways to have best possible video

with small

>> >> >> upload bandwidth (~1Mbit/s).
>> >> >> Simulcast is great for high bandwidth and really high
>> resolution, but
>> >> >> for low bandwidth you send 1250kbits (minimum bandwidth for 3

layers

>> >> >> simulcasts) for other participant to receive ~650kbits, which

is

>> a lot
>> >> >> of wasted bandwidth.
>> >> >>
>> >> >> I would like to add an option to keep the vignette (so that it
>> display
>> >> >> the name, the mic, and glow when someone talk) but just don't
>> show the
>> >> >> small video (also disabling simulcast), so that every
>> participant send
>> >> >> an hd stream, and receive only one hd stream, nothing more.

(i'm

>> using
>> >> >> x-google-max-bitrate and chrome only)
>> >> >> Do you think it's feasible? (some hints appreciated :slight_smile: )
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >> > You should be able to achieve this with lastN=1, in which case

you

>> >> can just disable simulcast (or keep it for the short-circuit

logic which

>> >> disables HD).
>> >>
>> >> lastN=1 prevent you from seeing another participant than the main
>> >> speaker, and remove the thumbnail which enable you to see who is
>> speaking
>> >> Also isn't lastN disabling non lastN video?
>> >
>> >
>> > Exactly, isn't this what you meant with "receive only one hd

stream,

>> nothing more"? If you want to receive one HD stream for the speaker

(and

>> no low quality streams for the speaker) and low quality (and no HD)

for

>> each non-speaker, then this is exactly what simulcast does. The only
>> waste is on the sending side.
>>
>> I don't want any waste on the sending side, so consider simulcast out,
>> what can i do to keep the thumbnail but without video in it, so that

i'm

>> not limited but receive side?
>
>
> You could set lastN=1, and modify the client to show the thumbnail,

but no video.

Does non lastN participant stop sending video? (Thus video/connection

need to ramp up each time)

···

Le 26 avr. 2016 8:02 PM, "Brian Baldino" <brian@highfive.com> a écrit :

On Tue, Apr 26, 2016 at 10:56 AM, Etienne Champetier < champetier.etienne@gmail.com> wrote:

Le 26 avr. 2016 7:41 PM, "Boris Grozev" <boris@jitsi.org> a écrit :
> On 26/04/16 12:04, Etienne Champetier wrote:
>> Le 26 avr. 2016 6:58 PM, "Boris Grozev" <boris@jitsi.org >> >> >> >> <mailto:boris@jitsi.org>> a écrit :
>> > On 26/04/16 11:50, Etienne Champetier wrote:
>> >> Le 26 avr. 2016 6:37 PM, "Boris Grozev" <boris@jitsi.org >> >> <mailto:boris@jitsi.org> >> >> >> <mailto:boris@jitsi.org <mailto:boris@jitsi.org>>> a écrit :
>> >> > On 26/04/16 11:28, Etienne Champetier wrote:

>
>
> Boris
>
> _______________________________________________
> dev mailing list
> dev@jitsi.org
> Unsubscribe instructions and other list options:
> http://lists.jitsi.org/mailman/listinfo/dev

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#17

Hi Experts,

I am not familiar with jitsi meet configuration .

I would like to ask some questions about my understanding of jitsi meet and would like to know if I am correct.

1: From ethereal capture. I found the following:

1) jitsi client keeps only one session between client and server. In this session there could be at least 1 audio stream and 1 video steam ( I can find the sdp in the signaling)

2) jitsi identify the audio stream and video stream via the prefix of payload I think . The length of audio is about 100Byte per packet and the length of video is about 1000Byte per packet.

3) I found different prefix in video payload so I guess they are different videos(one HD ,one low resolution ) . I can not make sure and will explain why I guess so below.

2: In the scenario of 4 clients, each participate will see 1 HD and 3 low resolution icon . I think the lease cost of bandwidth is 1 HD download stream and 3 low resolution download stream . So my follow question is

         Does jitsi do the resizing? I think no . if vp8 do not have a very cost effective algorithm ,it will cost many cpu resource.

         Does jitsi switch the the client’s upload stream between HD and low resolution fast enough ? I am not sure . If this works ,each clients only need to send on video stream which may change rapidly between High resolution and low resolution.

         So what I think is each client keep sending 1 HD stream and 1 low resolution to the jitsi server . So other client can get 1 HD downstream and 3 low resolution downstream and switch rapidly between them with low delay drive by the voice activation.

If so . each client will have 1 HD upstream, 1 HD downstream , 1 low resolution upstream , 3 resolution downstream. Through this operator can calculate the bandwidth in the server side .

         I think the HD upstream of non-active client is wasted. That’s why I want to know how jitsi works. I think the final aim we talking about simulast and lastN is to save bandwidth on server when we host a very large video room .

Also: when there are 100 clients in the room .I don’t think 1 HD and 99 low resolution downstream is need. Maybe 1 HD + 3 most active ones (next 3 on demand) is enough. Not sure if jitsi has parameter in configuration file to control this.

Thanks with regards,

David

···

发件人: dev [mailto:dev-bounces@jitsi.org] 代表 Etienne Champetier
发送时间: 2016年4月27日 2:10
收件人: Jitsi Developers <dev@jitsi.org>
主题: Re: [jitsi-dev] HD video and small bandwidth

Le 26 avr. 2016 8:02 PM, "Brian Baldino" <brian@highfive.com <mailto:brian@highfive.com> > a écrit :

If what you're asking is:

"If in last-n mode, does a sending client who is not currently being sent as part of the last-n group have to restart their bandwidth ramp up when they become part of the last-n again", the answer is no; they keep sending to the bridge so the bitrate adaption is continuous.

Thanks,
I will use lastN=1 then (and adapt gui a bit)

Thanks all and sorry for the misunderstanding

-brian

On Tue, Apr 26, 2016 at 10:56 AM, Etienne Champetier <champetier.etienne@gmail.com <mailto:champetier.etienne@gmail.com> > wrote:

Le 26 avr. 2016 7:41 PM, "Boris Grozev" <boris@jitsi.org <mailto:boris@jitsi.org> > a écrit :
>
> On 26/04/16 12:04, Etienne Champetier wrote:
>>
>> Le 26 avr. 2016 6:58 PM, "Boris Grozev" <boris@jitsi.org <mailto:boris@jitsi.org> >> >> >> >> <mailto:boris@jitsi.org <mailto:boris@jitsi.org> >> a écrit :
>> >
>> > On 26/04/16 11:50, Etienne Champetier wrote:
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> Le 26 avr. 2016 6:37 PM, "Boris Grozev" <boris@jitsi.org <mailto:boris@jitsi.org> >> >> <mailto:boris@jitsi.org <mailto:boris@jitsi.org> > >> >> >> <mailto:boris@jitsi.org <mailto:boris@jitsi.org> <mailto:boris@jitsi.org <mailto:boris@jitsi.org> >>> a écrit :
>>
>> >>
>> >> >
>> >> > On 26/04/16 11:28, Etienne Champetier wrote:
>> >> >>
>> >> >> Hi,
>> >> >>
>> >> >> I'm still thinking about ways to have best possible video with small
>> >> >> upload bandwidth (~1Mbit/s).
>> >> >> Simulcast is great for high bandwidth and really high
>> resolution, but
>> >> >> for low bandwidth you send 1250kbits (minimum bandwidth for 3 layers
>> >> >> simulcasts) for other participant to receive ~650kbits, which is
>> a lot
>> >> >> of wasted bandwidth.
>> >> >>
>> >> >> I would like to add an option to keep the vignette (so that it
>> display
>> >> >> the name, the mic, and glow when someone talk) but just don't
>> show the
>> >> >> small video (also disabling simulcast), so that every
>> participant send
>> >> >> an hd stream, and receive only one hd stream, nothing more. (i'm
>> using
>> >> >> x-google-max-bitrate and chrome only)
>> >> >> Do you think it's feasible? (some hints appreciated :slight_smile: )
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >> > You should be able to achieve this with lastN=1, in which case you
>> >> can just disable simulcast (or keep it for the short-circuit logic which
>> >> disables HD).
>> >>
>> >> lastN=1 prevent you from seeing another participant than the main
>> >> speaker, and remove the thumbnail which enable you to see who is
>> speaking
>> >> Also isn't lastN disabling non lastN video?
>> >
>> >
>> > Exactly, isn't this what you meant with "receive only one hd stream,
>> nothing more"? If you want to receive one HD stream for the speaker (and
>> no low quality streams for the speaker) and low quality (and no HD) for
>> each non-speaker, then this is exactly what simulcast does. The only
>> waste is on the sending side.
>>
>> I don't want any waste on the sending side, so consider simulcast out,
>> what can i do to keep the thumbnail but without video in it, so that i'm
>> not limited but receive side?
>
>
> You could set lastN=1, and modify the client to show the thumbnail, but no video.

Does non lastN participant stop sending video? (Thus video/connection need to ramp up each time)

>
>
> Boris
>
> _______________________________________________
> dev mailing list
> dev@jitsi.org <mailto:dev@jitsi.org>
> Unsubscribe instructions and other list options:
> http://lists.jitsi.org/mailman/listinfo/dev

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